Reimagining Leadership Roles: The Power of Cross-Industry Experience – interview with Thor Sandell

In this edition of The Leadership Insider, we delve into the transformative power of cross-industry experience through an insightful conversation with Thor Sandell, Vice President of HR at Hostess Brands Inc. Recently acquired by The J.M. Smucker Company, Hostess Brands is a leading player in the sweet snacks sector. In the interview with Margaret Jaouadi, Thor Sandell, whose career spans multiple industries and roles, shares his journey from engineering to HR, and how his diverse background has shaped his approach to talent management and organizational growth.

Thor’s extensive experience across various fields—from internal audit at General Electric to HR leadership at Hostess—illustrates the profound impact that cross-industry skills can have. He discusses the value of bringing fresh perspectives to traditional practices and how leveraging skills from different sectors can drive innovation and effectiveness. By highlighting specific examples and the importance of data-driven decision-making, Thor provides valuable insights into how organizations can benefit from embracing diverse professional backgrounds to solve complex challenges and enhance their strategic capabilities.

Special thanks go to Paul Galanti, Head of Industrial Sector, Americas at Pacific International, for introducing Thor Sandell to Margaret Jaouadi.

Margaret Jaouadi
Can you describe your current role and career path and what motivated you to transition to different industries?

Thor Sandell
As a VP of HR, I oversee several key talent groups, including Talent Acquisition and Corporate HR Business Partnering. While my title is VP of HR, I consider myself a business leader who happens to sit within HR, focused on helping talent grow their capability and career within an organization.

One of the things I’ve always emphasized in my career is the value of diverse experiences. I’ve had the opportunity to work as an HR Business Partner, transition into a central role, and then return to the field role. This type of career journey has been so incredibly beneficial for me—it’s like working in your field and applying your HR skills, then moving to a center to acquire new tools, to return to the field with new capabilities for real-world situations.

I strongly encourage anyone to take this path. Gaining varied experiences and stepping into different roles helps you develop a well-rounded practical skill set and accelerates your growth. It allows you to approach problems from multiple perspectives and equips you with a broader range of tools to solve them.

Throughout my career, I’ve worn many hats: I’ve worked in compensation, and quality, and even earned a black belt. I’ve been an HR Business Partner, led leadership development, designed benefits, and worked in both labor and non-labor roles. These diverse experiences enabled me to view challenges from various angles, and I highly recommend this approach to anyone looking to deepen their expertise and expand their HR capabilities.

Margaret Jaouadi
Can you give examples of benefits and unique perspectives you brought to your roles from your previous industry or function experience?

Thor Sandell
Let me share specific examples to illustrate the value of diverse experiences.

I served as a Quality Black Belt at General Electric and worked on projects that heavily relied on Six Sigma methodologies, specifically statistical modeling. When I transitioned to Pepsi Bottling Group, I was able to leverage those skills in a new context. For instance, the modeling techniques I learned at GE—like determining how to be 95% confident in a solution’s ability to predict an outcome—proved invaluable at Pepsi when addressing frontline staffing needs. I was able to apply those GE tools to predict with 95% certainty that we could meet service demands for every case in New Jersey. This approach, which differed significantly from previous operational estimates, sparked a productive conversation about what fully staffed should truly look like. The outcome was not only innovative but also enhanced to help encourage the adoption of our staffing innovations.

Another example comes from my time at PepsiCo’s headquarters, where I gained expertise in personality assessments. When I later moved into an HR Business Partner role at Hostess Brands, I saw an opportunity to apply these skills in a different industry. Our goal was to accelerate team performance, and by implementing the personality assessment techniques I had honed at Pepsi, we were able to significantly improve team effectiveness for my Hostess clients. The skills I acquired in one setting seamlessly translated to another, producing tangible results in a new industry—food manufacturing. I’m incredibly grateful for those earlier experiences, as they equipped me to drive performance improvements in a completely different environment.

Margaret Jaouadi
What challenges did you face during the transition and how did you overcome them?

Thor Sandell
This has been a key learning for me throughout my career. I’ve had the privilege of working across various industries—credit cards, power systems, beverages with Pepsi, tires with Bridgestone, and now sweet baked goods with Hostess. These industries are vastly different, and as an HR practitioner, transitioning from one to another requires a significant shift in how you think about and approach business challenges. Each industry operates under a unique model, and more importantly, they each have distinct talent pools that are critical to their success.

A skilled HR professional can quickly identify which talent pools are essential for driving the specific business they are servicing forward in the right way. The key is to start by asking the right questions: What problem are you trying to solve, and how can talent address that challenge? How can I, as an HR leader, ensure that these groups are positioned for success so that we achieve our business objectives? Over time, I have learned you don’t fully understand your specific business dynamic until you immerse yourself within your new environment, begin asking questions, and shed key assumptions from your experience.

Truly, I believe it’s essential to approach each new industry with a clean slate, ready to learn and adapt. You also need to be discerning about which tools and perspectives from your past experiences apply to your new context. Sometimes, you have to let go of approaches that work well in a different setting but aren’t ready or relevant for your current challenge. If you walk into a meeting with solutions to problems that haven’t been identified, you’re not truly addressing the business needs—you’re just offering generic HR advice. The focus must always be on what’s relevant to the business problem at hand.

Moving through different industries and centers of HR expertise has helped me refine this skill. It’s about recognizing what’s useful now, what might be relevant in the future, and what needs to be set aside to focus on the issue that truly matters today.

Margaret Jaouadi
Which skills and attributes do you believe are most critical and transferable across industries for senior roles?

Thor Sandell
That’s a great question. I would highlight three key crucial aspects.

First, it’s essential to have the ability to understand and diagnose an operating system, identifying where talent is critical to ensuring everything works together smoothly. This includes both the talent at an individual level and the overall organizational design. Being able to pinpoint areas where things are disconnected or not aligned is a skill that makes you valuable in any industry.

Second, having deep empathy is vital. This means not only understanding what the top levels of the organization are experiencing but also gaining clear insights into the challenges faced by the frontline. You need to truly feel what others are going through to offer meaningful support. I’ve noticed that those who possess this deep empathy tend to excel in HR, while those who don’t often find themselves switching jobs frequently—not because they’re being strategic, but because they may have worn out their welcome.

The third key aspect, which ties into the first two, is the ability to provide constructive feedback. It’s one thing to diagnose issues and empathize, but if you can’t deliver feedback in a way that’s clear, actionable, and sensitive to the situation, then your value at the leadership table diminishes. The ability to offer specific, timely, and useful feedback—without alienating others—is critical. Additionally, knowing when not to give feedback is just as important; timing can make all the difference.

Margaret Jaouadi
I can relate to the importance of balancing empathy with the courage to speak up, even in challenging situations. When I joined my current company, I was asked to present a SWOT analysis of the business at the board meeting—just three months in. It was daunting to point out weaknesses to people who knew the business inside out.

I had to trust my expertise, deliver my insights with empathy, and be brave enough to speak honestly. Though challenging, I consider this a growth moment in my career.

Thor Sandell
I agree, that you have to be smart, and you have to be thoughtful about what you’re sharing, and when you are sharing it.

Margaret Jaouadi
How can cross-industry experience make you a better leader?

Thor Sandell
I strongly encourage cross-industry experience because it forces you to approach business in a completely different way. As I mentioned earlier, there are key moments of truth where your organization’s success hinges—where volume meets price minus cost, and profitability is determined. You design your entire organization around delivering on these crucial moments.

Experiencing different industries allows you to view these moments through a fresh lens, helping you find new ways to achieve better outcomes. I have deep respect for those who’ve spent their careers in one industry, but I also recognize that over time, it can be harder to see things from a new perspective.

By stepping into a different industry, you can approach problem-solving in entirely new ways. There are countless examples in history, like the Fosbury Flop in the high jump, where a completely different technique led to superior results. Cross-industry experience provides the opportunity to think differently and potentially uncover better methods.

Margaret Jaouadi
Have you encountered many leaders who push back when you recommend a hire from a different industry?

Thor Sandell
It depends on the leader. I’ve worked with leaders who prioritize deep industry experience, especially when someone must have the fundamentals in place from day one. At senior levels, there often isn’t time to develop those basics—you’re hired to run things, not to be developed into that Senior role.

However, many senior leaders I’ve worked with also highly value fresh perspectives and unique approaches to problem-solving. Often, a role becomes open because the previous person couldn’t solve the issues effectively, so bringing in someone who can view the problem differently can be a helpful pivot.

Overall, I haven’t encountered much pushback, aside from ensuring the candidate has the basic requisite skills and experience, which sometimes are industry-specific. But beyond those basics, leaders I’ve worked with are generally eager for new solutions to persistent problems.

I also believe that it’s important for leaders to be open to evolving their thinking during the hiring process. Sometimes, after interviewing candidates, they realize they need a different skill set than initially thought. Throwing out the old job description and redesigning the role to better fit the business needs shows intellectual curiosity and a willingness to adapt. It’s crucial to be nimble and evolve to meet challenges—recycling the same old approach or talent profile will provide poor results.

Margaret Jaouadi
How important is it to increase diversity and representation in senior roles, especially in male-dominated industries, and what steps can encourage that?

Thor Sandell
This is highly relevant to cross-industry experience and diversity. Everyone brings their own “corner of truth,” and building a team that can pull from these varied perspectives is crucial for future success. If everyone on the team looks and thinks the same, they might be great at solving today’s problems but could struggle with future challenges.

For example, in male-dominated industries, it’s important to remember that women make up half the world and bring a perspective that men don’t. Gender diversity, like other forms of diversity, adds different perspectives and experiences that businesses should leverage.

The first step is recognizing the importance of diverse thinking. Then, it’s about building a team that’s agile and capable of seeing a broader truth than the competition. Without this, a team may not be effective long-term. Tactically, it’s about deciding whether to develop this diversity internally or bring it in from the outside—both are valid, and the right choice depends on the business situation.

Margaret Jaouadi
Can I also ask, since you mentioned the skills assessment earlier, whether part of your process involves looking at the team as a whole before filling a leadership vacancy? Do you evaluate what skills might be missing or what you’d like to enhance within the team, in addition to considering the specific role itself?

Thor Sandell
Yes, that’s all part of the role design. I regularly work with managers to evaluate what we have on paper and explore how we can make it better. We start by asking, “If we’re going to improve this, where should we begin?” Is it about new skills and capabilities, different teaming, or a shift in mindset? Are there skills we haven’t considered that we should be curious about and include in a new document? I collaborate with leaders constantly to ensure we’re evolving—I do think that a few iterations to improve is so valuable! If we don’t, we risk just recycling old practices, which can lead to stagnation or worse.

Margaret Jaouadi
What recommendations do you have for hiring leaders to consider cross-industry candidates?

Thor Sandell

I’d encourage leaders to think about evolution. Just as species must adapt to survive, organizations need to evolve to stay relevant. Bringing in talent that can drive appropriate adaptation is key to ensuring your business remains healthy and forward-looking. If you’re not doing that, you risk becoming a dinosaur, and we all know how that story ends. So, using an evolutionary metaphor, I’d say that considering cross-industry experience is essential for long-term survival. It gives you new ideas and leadership DNA to adapt your business for the long haul!

Margaret Jaouadi
How would you encourage people to view themselves as specialists within their industry and professionals with transferable skills that can be valuable across different sectors? How can they think about applying for roles outside their current field to enhance their growth while bringing fresh perspectives to new industries?

Thor Sandell
Absolutely, great question. There are a few key points to consider, so let me walk through them.

First, it’s crucial to align internal teams with the idea that cross-industry experience is valuable. This mindset shift is important, and teams need to understand how such experience can be beneficial. Second, it’s essential to make this value known externally as well, by highlighting it in job descriptions. You can’t just rely on posting a job and hoping the right people see it; you need your internal talent team, and any external partners you work with, to know that this is something you’re actively seeking.

Building a diverse slate of candidates that includes cross-industry experience allows hiring managers to make informed decisions. Ultimately, while the hiring decision is up to the manager, my role is to ensure they’re considering these broader perspectives, not just for today’s needs but to future-proof the organization. That’s the real, noble work HR can support.

Another key point is HR’s role in providing data and analytics. Conducting talent audits, for example, can show senior teams the types of diversity being brought in, whether it’s gender diversity or cross-functional hires. This data is powerful—it helps ensure that hiring practices are evolving rather than stagnating.

Lastly, it’s important to share the success stories of those who have thrived in new industries. This narrative can help break down myths and build a case for why cross-industry experience matters. I’ve used data to challenge assumptions before—for instance, by analyzing variables that managers believed were critical for success, only to find that some of these assumptions are not supported by data. When you can present a mathematical argument, it becomes easier to shift perspectives.

So, it’s about mindset, communication, analysis, and storytelling. These elements can help organizations recognize and leverage the value of cross-industry experience.

Margaret Jaouadi
Excellent! I love that myth-busting approach. It makes a difference because, without the numbers, people often won’t believe it. But when you present the data, it’s a game-changer.

Thor Sandell
Your point got me thinking. One way to shift that mindset is by creating heroes—people who exemplify how cross-industry experience works. While this might resonate with some, it doesn’t always appeal to engineers, for instance. So, speaking their language, which is often math and data, is crucial. Providing clear, data-driven reasons to challenge and update outdated beliefs can help move things forward effectively.

Margaret Jaouadi
Thank you, Thor, it’s been a pleasure talking with you.

For a confidential chat about how Pacific International can assist you with your Talent Acquisitions and Diversity challenges, please contact Manuel Preg or one of our Executive Search Consultants specialising in your sector.